June 25, 2021 at 8:37 pm #12911
And if I were trying to do a 70.3 and 140.6 that were 10 weeks apart, I don’t want to burden you with the task of trying to figure this out in gory detail, but one idea I have is to do the entire 70.3 plan (Half Level 2) placing the 70.3 on its natural race day, then doing the last 10 weeks (weeks 14 to 23) of the IM Level 2 training plan leading up to the 140.6, with an “easy/no running” adjusted week (week 14 of IM L2) immediately after the 70.3? That would be 29 weeks of training for the 2 races. I don’t need all of the granular details to the solution at this point – it’s more of a hypothetical, but I am not sure which 70.3 I will be able to register for (dictated by family schedule) and would like the comfort to know that there are fairly straightforward solutions to being able to do a 70.3 6 weeks before or 10 weeks before a 140.6 – and if I can understand how to create that solution that’s even better! Thanks!June 30, 2021 at 10:06 am #12988
@david – just trying to wrap this TLDR thread up with some clarity, any brief guidance on the two lingering questions:
1. how to do a 70.3 (B race) and then 140.6 (A race) 6 weeks apart? so that would mean the B race would land on week 17, not week 16, on the unmodified Ironman Level 2 plan.
2. how to do a 70.3 (B race) and then 140.6 (A race) 10 weeks apart
Thank you for guiding me (and the larger community) on these two scenarios.June 30, 2021 at 4:49 pm #12995
Ted, apologies, I’ll have this answered by Thursday EOD.July 1, 2021 at 10:19 pm #13035
Ted, thanks for your patience on this one. The 10 weeks out scenario would be much better for your IM event.
In the 6 weeks out scenario, swap week 16 and 17 of the IM Level 2 plan so that the 70.3 falls on the rest week. The Saturday and Sunday workouts in Week 16 (now Week 17) now become your 70.3. No running for 6 days after the race (run the RAE11 the following week-end), but you can keep cycling and swimming per the unmodified schedule the week after the race. Perform the RAe9 instead of the RAe1 the end of Week 18.
In the 10 weeks out scenario, swap weeks 12 and 13 so that the 70.3 falls on the rest week. The Saturday and Sunday workouts in Week 12 (now Week 13) now become your 70.3. The remainder of Week 12 is unmodified. No running for 6 days after the race (run the following week-end), but you can keep cycling and swimming per the unmodified schedule.
DavidJuly 4, 2021 at 3:42 pm #13076
Awesome! Thanks Coach David!July 4, 2021 at 4:34 pm #13077
Am I correct to assume the reason the 70.3 B Race 10 weeks before 140.6 A Race is much better than 70.3 B Race 6 weeks before 140.6 A Race is simply that 6 weeks is too short an amount of time to recover from the 70.3? Or is there another reason?July 7, 2021 at 6:36 pm #13147
6 weeks is just really close in terms of recovery and specificity and other intangibles. You can do a quick thought experiment. Should you do an IM 1 week after a 70.3? Instinctively, we know that’s not a good idea. 2 weeks after? Still no. 6 weeks is still in the “man, that’s really close together” range. On the other end of the spectrum, we also know that 100 weeks between is too much. There is period between races that represents optimal planning, but the variables involved are complicated. In your particular scenario, I find the 10 week version superior to the 6 week.
DavidJuly 26, 2021 at 4:01 pm #13485
Hi David – Me again on this longest thread ever… Sorry! So IM 70.3 Chattanooga in 2022 turns out to be May 22, 2022 not the week before as I had anticipated, so on my IM Level 2 schedule ending with a Race day of Sunday July 24 (IM Lake Placid), that puts 70.3 Chatt on week 14, 9 weeks, not 10, before the full 140.6 race. Following your approach of swapping weeks a bit to put a recovery week from another week on week 14, I imagine you might recommend this as a solution, but please let me know if you have a better idea:
1. Move original week 12 a recovery week (8:02) to week 11
2. Move original week 13 (12:13) to week 12
3. Move original week 11 (12:27) to week 13
4. Swap original weeks 16-17 to make w17 a recovery week instead of week 16
5. Copy original week 16 to week 14 and modify it to be a 70.3 B race week.
The problem was that W14 is 2 weeks after the last race week, and 2 weeks before the next one. Smack dab in the middle, so I couldn’t see how a simple swap of one week for another would solve this, but maybe you do. So my solution was to basically insert a new recovery week at week 14, and then move the two existing recovery weeks W12 and W16 one week further away from W14 so for each period before a recovery week there would be at least 2 weeks of higher volume training. Alternatively, I could do a “half week recovery” pre 70.3 Chattanooga. What’s your thought on the best solution?
Once you’ve made recommendation on that, then my question is, will my training volume at that stage in this training plan be suitable for the 2.5 hr hard ride and about 2 hr hard run off the bike at a competitive (~top 20% finish) level? I was looking at the training in the Weeks 12-16 of the original plan and while there are rides of 4hrs, and runs of 2 hrs in the training calendar at that stage the bricks are rather short (generally in the 1 hr bike, 1 hr run range.) Is that adequate preparation for a competitive 70.3 performance? Are there modifications you’d recommend to be adequately prepared for the 70.3 in May, such as adding an extra hour of cycling to the 60min/60min bricks around that time, or am I overdoing it?July 28, 2021 at 7:56 pm #13559
Ted, give me a couple more days on this one, still on my radar!July 29, 2021 at 3:24 pm #13578
Thanks!August 12, 2021 at 2:16 pm #13874
Ted, sorry for the late reply.
I’ve been staring at the screen for 20 minutes. There is no great solution here. The timing of the two events is perfectly mis-aligned. I’m reminded of one of Matt’s favorite metaphors: “How do I turn this pizza into a cake? Throw away the pizza and bake a cake.”
But, I can endorse your proposed change. It’s good. I think there may be better ways to to adjust this, but your proposal is strong.
This forum is certainly for helping to customize plans, but the level of customization required in this scenario is complex. Fortunately, we do provide a plan customization service where Matt can customize your plan to perfectly fit this situation.
However, May is a long, long way off. So much can happen between now and then. Any customization of the plan now will almost certainly be obsolete before May (just look at this thread as an example, how many plan iterations we’ve already gone through). My advise is…wait. Wait until April and if you still have a 70.3 on May 22 and an IM on July 24 then reach out for that custom plan.
DavidAugust 13, 2021 at 12:34 pm #13892
Excellent guidance all around! Thanks, David!
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