RHM1 Questions | 80/20 Endurance

RHM1 Questions

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  • #17929
    ryanoelke
    Participant

    Hey Everyone πŸ™‚ I have my RHM1 session coming up in a few weeks, stoked for it. Have a few questions I couldn’t find answers for:

    1. It says to run at HM pace, regardless of zone. I’m wondering though if I’m still supposed to keep myself to keep my HR to zone 3, which is what my plan is based on. Not sure how much to watch my HR going above zone 3 in this workout, even if my pacing is in Zone 3.

    2. This one being distance based, I’m wondering a bit about GPS inaccuracy. On the track, my Garmin is generous and thinks I’ve reached a mile when I still have 100 meters to go. Running in the park for long runs, I’m certain it short changes me a good bit, which adds up over longer duration. Anyways, do I just ignore this? I assume the structured workout will just stop that lap when I reach 3km, regardless if that’s really accurate.

    3. Last question – I’m a bit more of a speedster, ran middle distance in HS. For my long Sunday runs (1hr 40 minutes yesterday), I felt great aerobically, in low to mid zone 2 HR the whole time, but I’m running zone 1 pace. So, I’m curious how reliable the RHM1 workout will be to tell me about pacing? If I’m able to do that workout at the zone 3 pace/hr, would you say it’s ballpark accurate? If in the workout, holding zone 3 pacing is too tough, do I drop to Zone X pacing to get my HR down?

    Thanks so much, 80/20 training is AMAZING. Reading the pacing book now πŸ™‚
    -Ryan

    #17930
    Charles
    Participant

    WRT Garmin accuracy you might want to look at your settings. https://support.garmin.com/en-US/?faq=xQvHXbfaT27Zr4hxZDvjv5

    I have mine set to the maximum accuracy and get good results on the track and trails. That requires more storage on the watch, but I haven’t seen any negatives with the increased setting – but I don’t go out there for hours at a time…

    #17937
    ryanoelke
    Participant

    Thanks for the link, Charles! The park trail is under a lot of canopy or runs in the open, along a tree canopy, and this is where it’s horrible, thinking I’m running a 12-15 minute pace. But one thing in that article that was helpful is the “gps soak”. I did notice that getting my watch ready in the run activity, ready for the structured workout to go helps, but I think a bigger soak is needed. Today I ran in the open loop at the park because I was doing a steady state run and needed better pacing info. But I noticed that after that, for the cool down I went under canopy and it seemed to hold up a bit better.

    Do you use the Every Second option for GPS? I have a Fenix 5x, so not sure how the memory holds up.

    #17947
    Charles
    Participant

    I do use the Every Second option. I have never had a memory issue on my FR 630 or FR 745. I would suggest you give it a try; if you compare the map on Garmin Connect post-run I think you will see a significant improvement in the positional data.

    I run a couple of races on certified courses each year and found that my watch(s) have been within a couple of meters of the certified distances.

    Still, it’s not perfect. I occasionally see hiccups in areas with tall buildings. Another option is to consider using a Stryd Power Meter which can be calibrated for distance without GPS – I haven’t tried using my power meter in that configuration, so I don’t know how well it works.

    #17948
    ryanoelke
    Participant

    You are my hero! This is going to be awesome. Ok, I updated that, and then for Secondary Satellites setting, I see my watch actually has Normal GPS, GPS + GLONASS, GPS + GALILEO, and Ultratrack. Looks like GPS + GLONASS and GPS + GALILEO are the better options, more combined satellites, and from what it looks like, maybe GPS + GLONASS is better? Let me know if you use this setting πŸ™‚

    Thanks!
    -Ryan

    #17950
    Charles
    Participant

    I haven’t played with the other settings, I’m just using Normal GPS.

    #17952
    ryanoelke
    Participant

    Roger that, I’ll let you know how it goes πŸ™‚

    #17954
    David Warden
    Keymaster

    @Charles, thanks for the great response on the Garmin.


    @ryanoelke
    ,

    1. I wouldn’t say the RHM1 is HM pace “regardless of zone” as you can’t perform a HM at Zone 4, for example. It does give you the latitude to test your own pacing, which may be Zone 2 or mid-Zone 3, See https://www.8020endurance.com/race-pacing/ for more information. Regarding whether to monitor HR or Pace, this is related to my same answer for #3…

    3. We address this in our document https://www.8020endurance.com/getting-started-with-80-20-training/

    Q: My pace (or power) and heart rate zones don’t line up. For example, when I’m in Zone 2 for pace I’m in Zone X for heart rate.

    “A: This issue is usually resolved by ensuring that you use one field test to capture the threshold of multiple intensity types as outlined in the documents Intensity Guidelines for Running or Intensity Guidelines for Triathlon. By measuring Pace, Power, and/or HR in a single test, the three intensity types may align. However, due to the inconsistent nature of heart rate, it is normal for a given output to result in a different heart rate on a subsequent day. This is a normal phenomenon when using heart rate.”

    Overall, I’d recommend just picking a single measure of intensity, don’t try to mix and match.

    David

    #17956
    ryanoelke
    Participant

    Thanks, David! This is super helpful and puts my mind at ease for the workout.

    With respect to #1, I wonder though about cardiac drift, which I know you all have mentioned in here is natural and doesn’t mean that you should slow down. Of course that’s dependent on duration/distance. I guess I’m wondering how much this is a factor the the RHM1 workout, and it might not be relevant at all given it’ll be shorter that a full HM.

    That race pace chart is super helpful you linked to! The RHM1 workout says zone 3 but of course could be lower zone. This chart is even more specific that low zone 3 is a veteran. So I assume that even if I’m in zone 3 and can do the 3km repeats at mid or high zone 3, better to do it at low zone 3 (or lower)?

    #3 I hear you on that πŸ™‚ In general, I really stick to HR pretty hard core and that’s working for me.

    Thank you!

    #17961
    David Warden
    Keymaster

    Cardiac drift is difficult to react to as it depends on the environment. You’re going to experience greater CD in a warm than a cold environment, and so placing arbitrary triggers and decision based on HR is risky. But, ignoring cardiac drift altogether is also risky. I would not worry about CD at al for the RHM1, but I’d watch HR on your HM race while still using Pace as primary.

    Yes, even though you can do the RHM1 much faster, stick with your estimated race pace.

    David

    #17962
    ryanoelke
    Participant

    awesome, thanks so much, David!

    #17963
    ryanoelke
    Participant

    Oh, one thing I wanted to share is that graph, if using the novice pace for HM, puts me literally right smack on a 2hr pace πŸ™‚ If my legs can hold up, hoping to just crack 2 hrs. This chart and that RHM1 session will be super helpful in finding out what’s actually doable. Thanks!

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